Training Question

[SizeMatters]

Alright.. a quick training question for you boys. Now, granted genetics have a lot to do with this, that we know. But, what the Hell exercises do you guys do THAT HAVE BIG LATS? I've tried every frickin back exercise you could possibly think of and I am like a Circus Side Show Freak "THE AMAZING LATLESS MAN!" =#

I mean WTF does a guy have to do? Are you guys hitting low volume or high volume... training more than once a week.... isolating with certain machines... what? Somebody that has good lat development please hit me up with their workout routine, so I can see if I am way off base or just genetic garbage... =gr)

Thanks is advance!

- LATLESS MAN

[Stroyer]

well i personally think my back is one of my best assets i personally train low/moderate volume with all out intensity

todays back workout ex consisted with;

front pulldowns
bent barbell rows
1 arm hammer rows
seated reverse grip cable rows

i do 1-2 heavy sets per ex shooting for 6-10 reps on the heaviest set

one of the main keys to back training is feel if you have to lighten up you pdg used & really focus on feeling you lats doing all the work do this for a few workouts before moving back up in pdgs i think you will notice a big difference

stroyer

[SizeMatters]

Okay.. sounds reasonable... how many sets are you talking about for each exercise? And for all out intensity on the heavy sets are you talking gut ripping insanity or are you sticking to strict form and going as heavy as that allows you to?

[Stroyer]

always stay strict as reasonably possible

i do no more than 2 "all out" sets per ex depending if i feel i got everything outta me on the first heavy set er not

on the "all out" sets they are of course taken to failure & sometimes beyond using drop sets, partials, negatives or rest pause depends on the ex doing = what technique is used

stroyer

[SizeMatters]

Okay cool.. so you are really go low volume... 4 exercises with 2 sets each..... maybe I am overtraining?? Hmmmmm.... I usually do 5 exercises, 3 sets each, trying to hit from every possible angle there is. I do train heavy and stay with 6-8 reps and I keep reasonable form throughout..... Hell, I don't know...

Maybe I can be the first guy to get Lat Implants!!! SWEET JESUS!!

Thanks for the input, Stroyer.


(=)

[Stroyer]

how frequently do you train each muscle ?

stroyer

[SizeMatters]

Well Bro, I train each muscle group once a week right now. I am not "on" anything, and I make good gains on this split, except for my back.

MONDAY: CHEST
TUESDAY: BACK
WEDNESDAY: LEGS
THURSDAY: ARMS
FRIDAY: SHOULDERS

This way I can get a full week recovery for each muscle group and I can really max out my intensity of training.... I usually need the full week in between workouts....

However, like I said, I tend to hit 4 or 5 exercises and at least 3 sets for each...

My back development isn't bad, except for my lats. I have deep, mature muscle bodies throughout, but I have the lats of a 13 year old girl... I don't know what it is... I will try lower volume for a few weeks and see if that helps.

[Stroyer]

most importantly try really focusing on the feel as i described above..possibly if need be lighten up yer pdgs a tad & really go for strict form & feel, if you cant pause with the weight at any part of the movement (exception being the last few reps when failure approaches) then you may be using to much pdg

think of your arms as chains & hands as hooks & focus on your back/lats doing the movement

stroyer

[SizeMatters]

Alright Bro... I've tried that in the past... holding the squeeze and trying to focus on the lat... I've gotten away from that a little trying to go "ballistic". I have been really giving an all out 100% shot right through the concentric part of the motion. And I have been eliminating as much of the negative as possible, and going down quickly. The theory behind that is that you save the ATP energy sources in your muscles by eliminating the eccentric portion of the lifts..... it works GREAT on arms.... I get sore as Hell now.... and good strength gains....

[Stroyer]

I feel the negative portion of the movement is damn near the most important, this has even been proven in various studies that performing the negative slower than the positive yields greater overall strength gains

why do you think many trainers incorporate now & then negative only reps with ultra heavy pdgs

i do just the opposite as you, i make sure to emphasize the negative more & slower than the positive which is perfomed slightly more rapidly

stroyer

[BigKraut]

This will go over like a lead ball, but the core mass builders for back are still and always will be:

Barbell deadlifts,

Barbell bent rows,

and Chins. Weighted, if you can.

Make sure you work traps with some heavy shrugs. If not on back day, then on shoulder day. Nothing looks as silly as huge lats with flat traps! lol.

[Bigbadasian]

|---[\\\\\]>--------- IMO, heavy chins and bent-over rows are the best...granted, you have to add an exer. or 2 along with those, but those are the 'core' i think.

[jawbreakerkid]

if you're still doing the same workout you did when we trained together you're doing pull downs, pull downs, pull downs and some more pull downs (with a couple sets of cable rows). My back blew up on my last cycle (so did my face \./ ) doing hammerstrength pull downs, hammerstrength rows, and usually something different everytime for my thrid exercise (bent over rows, lawn mower pulls, cable rows..etc). Going heavy on all but never under 6 reps.

[SizeMatters]

Well, let's see... I start with 3 sets of Chin-Ups to failure.... then I do Barbell Shrugs.... then on to Pull Downs (front)... then I do Hammer Strength seated row... then I do Reverse Grip pulldowns... then I do Dead Lifts... and finally Seated Row or v-bar Pulldowns.... maybe even Hammer Strength Pulldowns... and occassionally I throw in Lawn Mowers.......

I do 5 exercises per workout... 3 sets of each... 6-8 reps......

Good Lord...

Oh.. and JBK... read your statement again...... "your back blew up on your LAST CYCLE".... hmmmm? Ever had your back grow while OFF? Of couse it grew while you were on... you could open your fridge 10 times and your back will grow while you are on!!! lol


Thanks for the input guys... my guess is that I have a genetics problem or a lack of illegal supplementation problem... LMAO!!

[Bigbadasian]

|---[\\\\]>-------- Wow....15 sets...that's a lot...you still feel that you can go to 15 sets? I'm fried after 9 usually and my back cant' take anymore....

[Bigbadasian]

|---[\\\\]>-------- Actually SM, the more i read this thread, the more i wonder...why even care? You have the rest of the package...why dont you just leave posts like these to genetic defects like myself who have absolutly nothing! =2) lol

[BigKraut]

You're over training Sparky! If you train back properly with the heavy basics, those few sets will leave you physically exhausted. You're doing too much to be doing it right. Done properly, you won't be able to do all of those exercises. You have to hit the back with mind numbingly heavy weights, bro. I mean REAL FUGGIN HEAVY!!! Hang a few plates from your waist while you chin to failure and those pulldowns are not going to fly. Deadlifting should be first in your routine. It should be the heaviest exercise you do in any training routine, except for maybe squats. Those deadlifts should have you on the verge of shitting yourself. If you're not at least farting, you're not going heavy enough. The combo of exertion and odor ought to leave you feeling ill at the end of a dadlift session! Then comes the heavy rows, and then the chins. Done with the necessary intensity and bung hole puckering poundages, Your Lats Will Grow! Peace.

[jawbreakerkid]

acutally, yes skippy, my back has grown while I'm off. If everyone's back blew up when people were on you wouldn't be having this problem now would you? lol

[SizeMatters]

Originally posted by Bigbadasian
|---[\\\\]>-------- Actually SM, the more i read this thread, the more i wonder...why even care? You have the rest of the package...why dont you just leave posts like these to genetic defects like myself who have absolutly nothing! =2) lol

Well, my little yellow Ninja friend.... imagine standing on stage at about 3% bodyfat and hitting a nice big double bicep pose with 20" guns... your abs and intercostals are popping out all over like you have small pox and WHAMMO!! You are the same width in your armpits as you are at your waist.... lmao... the judges start laughing after gasping at your arms development and your 50 abs.... and ask you after the show if you had some kind of accident and had to amputate your lats.... LMAO!!! It's kinda embarrassing, you know? lol

They have a new pose out now for my shows.. it's the "LATLESS SPREAD"... It's my strength....... lol

So, it look like I am overtraining... gonna drop the volume and concentrate on the negative a little more and see what happens.

If nothing else I can get implants when JBK goes in for his calf implants!! lol

(=)

[jawbreakerkid]

I'm saving my pennies... lol

[Paul Bunyan]

I'm gonna contradict a few people here on lat training. I train lats 3 times per wk. Only one exercise per session for 3-4 sets. These are the exercises I use: low pulley rows, chest supported rows, barbell rows, and standing rows with green Jump-Stretch bands. Reps are usually in the 10-20 range. You have to feel the movement in the lats, period. Don't worry about how much weight is on the bar but don't make it too light.
Sample workouts:
Monday: Heavy back/leg day standing rows w/ bands 3 sets 10
Wed: Heavy BP day low pulley rows 300lbs sets 12-15reps
Sunday: Light BP day chest supported rows 4 plates 4 sets 12
Rest periods are only the time it takes my partner to finish his set which is around 30- 45 secs.
My upper back and lats are extremely thick and wide. Intensity is also key to development. DON'T GO TO THE GYM TO FUCK AROUND AND SOCIALIZE! Save it for after your workout. This is only a brief glimpse at my workouts. The total tonnage and the short time it takes me to complete a workout will cripple most people. PB

[Bigbadasian]

|---[\\\\]>--------- calves are over-rated..if you wear pants all the time like i do, it doesn't matter!lol